July 31, 2024 Planning Board Special Meeting Transcript - WEHI

ere is, when rock is encountered, and 20 there is shallow rock in portions of the site, per 21 the geotechnical reports, they're indicating that 22 top portions of this may be able to be ripped and 23 removed because they're already fractured, and 24 that's the investigation that Mr. Anderson was -- 25 was talking about with a contractor. The Page 88 1 contractors don't just make these decisions, it's 2 done with engineers and studies. In addition to 3 this is that a building like this, it's not that an 4 architect designs it, it's not just that a 5 structural engineer is involved and a geotechnical 6 engineer, but there's also inspections, inspections 7 by the town and also third-party independent 8 inspections, so the developer has to hire these 9 inspectors as well that are looking at strength of 10 concrete, placing of reinforcement bars, elements 11 like this, so there are a lot of levels of design 12 and redundancy, all that create an enhanced factor 13 of safety for the construction. I don't look at 14 this as anywhere -- like, when you look at this and 15 you see this in scale, it's nowhere hanging off a 16 cliff, it is not at all concerning, but that's not 17 just me. The geotech engineer and the structural 18 engineer will be looking at that and determining how 19 deep he needs these to go and to what level they 20 need to go to get either satisfactory soils or to -- 21 into existing bedrock. 22 So, let's see. I think I have covered 23 all of the items that I wanted to cover in my 24 testimony. I do have the remainder of my 25 architectural drawing submittals with me here as Page 89 1 well, but I don't know whether, at this scale on a 2 screen, I don't know whether it's useful time to 3 walk through and talk about all the, you know, the 4 way the buildings are laid out, but if there are 5 questions, I can certainly point to one of these 6 exhibits to aid any of the Board members or... 7 MR. PLOCKER: I just have a couple of 8 follow-up questions for Mr. Appel before we turn it 9 over to the Board. 10 Mr. Appel, obviously, there are a 11 hundred affordable housing units proposed. 12 MR. APPEL: Correct. 13 MR. PLOCKER: And there are state 14 regulations which govern the number of one, two- and 15 three-bedroom units that are required. Are you 16 familiar with those? 17 MR. APPEL: Yes, that's exactly what 18 Mr. -- I think it was testified by Mr.

ions which govern the number of one, two- and 15 three-bedroom units that are required. Are you 16 familiar with those? 17 MR. APPEL: Yes, that's exactly what 18 Mr. -- I think it was testified by Mr. Anderson. 19 MR. PLOCKER: Yeah, I just wanted to 20 confirm as the architect -- 21 MR. APPEL: Yes. 22 MR. PLOCKER: -- and we are looking at 23 some unit layouts now. Do the affordable units 24 comply with those regulations? 25 MR. APPEL: A hundred percent,

24 (Pages 90 to 93) Page 90 1 correct. 2 MR. PLOCKER: Okay, thank you very 3 much. And also, with respect to the amenities, is 4 it fair to say that a large majority of the 5 amenities are focused towards the center of the 6 overall site? 7 MR. APPEL: Well, the largest amenity 8 is the clubhouse, which is at the center of the 9 site, so I will -- let's see. I think the best way 10 to show this over here is our clubhouse is over 11 here, so this is -- this is the center of the site, 12 this is that rotunda, the traffic circle that Mr. 13 Klein was referring to earlier. So we have the 14 clubhouse structure over here and then directly to 15 the side, we have two tennis courts and a pool. The 16 tennis courts are up on the high side and then 17 there's a transition grade-wise to the pool on the 18 lower side, and then obviously, I will say Building 19 A, which is in two pieces, Building B, Building C, 20 and to the right is Building D shall and Building D 21 is also in two separate pieces so it presents itself 22 as two separate buildings. 23 MR. PLOCKER: Okay. Thank you, Larry. 24 I have nothing further for Mr. Appel. 25 CHAIRMAN BAGOFF: Okay. Thank you, Page 91 1 Mr. Appel. We'll start with Ms. Kapferer. Do you 2 have any questions for Mr. Appel about his 3 testimony? 4 MS. KAPFERER: Yes. Thank you, Mr. 5 Chairman. I do have a few questions. 6 MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC: Can you 7 raise... 8 CHAIRMAN BAGOFF: Speak louder. 9 MS. KAPFERER: Yes. I'll do my best 10 here. I do have a few questions. One is about roof 11 drainage. Are you at the point in your design where 12 you have a sense for where downspouts will be, any 13 comment on that? 14 MR. APPEL: So this -- these 15 buildings, for the most part, have internal drainage 16 structures so they're taken down through the 17 building because they're flat roof. The only 18 building that -- well, the maintenance building has 19 a pitch roof and the clubhouse has a partial pitch 20 roof, but most of the roof water is going to be 21 coming down and is going to be collected and 22 conveyed into the drainage systems that Mr. Anderson 23 designed. What's good about this is it's all clean 24 water, it doesn't have to be treated. 25 MS. KAPFERER: Yeah, one other Page 92 1 question about the roofs. What other -- I know 2 that, like, you just shared, you know, some are 3 flat, some are sloped. What kinds of equipment will 4 you

25 MS. KAPFERER: Yeah, one other Page 92 1 question about the roofs. What other -- I know 2 that, like, you just shared, you know, some are 3 flat, some are sloped. What kinds of equipment will 4 you need to have, if any, on some of the roof 5 structures? 6 MR. APPEL: So for the most part, and 7 I can go to one of the -- one of the roofs. Let's 8 see. Well, really, any of them. Each of the 9 apartments are going to have a condensing unit, so 10 for the most part, all of these condensing units 11 will be located up on the roof. They take a small 12 area, they're tended -- they tend to, we call them, 13 like a condenser farm, we huddle them together and 14 they're kind of pods on the -- on the roof and they 15 take a portion of the roof. All of the buildings, 16 A, B and C, do not have occupiable roofs. Building 17 D does, so there, we basically worked around all of 18 those condensing units so that we provided 19 programmatic space as well as condensing space. 20 Space for the condensers. 21 MS. KAPFERER: Okay. And those spaces 22 are separate? 23 MR. APPEL: Yes. 24 MS. KAPFERER: You mentioned in your 25 testimony that you had incorporated green design Page 93 1 features. Can you share more specifically about 2 what those features are? 3 MR. APPEL: They are fully enumerated 4 in the settlement agreement. These have to do with 5 certain types of lighting, certain types of plumbing 6 fixtures, efficiency of heating and air- 7 conditioning. We are designing the roofs so that 8 the structural system can accommodate future solar 9 panels. So there's a bunch of items like this. It 10 also has to do with colors, lighting that does not 11 project, you know, that the lighting is facing 12 downward so that you don't get a lot of light 13 filtering up into the sky, so efficiency of windows, 14 efficiency of appliances. In many cases, we have 15 designed these similar to provisions in Energy Star 16 and other green standards, but we are not going 17 through the whole process to do all the 18 certification. We have a series of items that are 19 outlined in the settlement agreement. Some of them, 20 you have to -- are mandatory and some of them are 21 optional, and the ones that are optional, you have 22 to do a certain number of them to comply, so we're 23 -- we've gone through that and that is actually one 24 of the reasons why we went to a pitched roof, 25 because the

that are optional, you have 22 to do a certain number of them to comply, so we're 23 -- we've gone through that and that is actually one 24 of the reasons why we went to a pitched roof, 25 because the efficiency for the equipment that we can

25 (Pages 94 to 97) Page 94 1 place on a -- on a flat roof is much higher; we 2 couldn't get the efficiencies to work on some of the 3 other equipment. 4 MR. PLOCKER: And just for the record, 5 that the settlement agreement Mr. Appel is referring 6 to, it is the design terms and conditions contained 7 in Exhibit C. 8 MS. KAPFERER: Yeah, one more question 9 about the roof. I know you said there are, like, 10 roof terraces and public areas and there are 11 balconies as well. Can you tell us about -- I 12 imagine there's a typical height for, like, fence 13 around that. I'm just thinking of kids, you know, 14 are kids roaming around up there? Are they going to 15 be climbing the sides? Like, how -- can you 16 describe how they're safe? 17 MR. APPEL: So there's two -- there 18 are two issues that need to be addressed in here. 19 Typically one is sometimes we do higher elements as 20 windbreaks and sometimes you do mandatory for what's 21 called a guardrail. The guardrails need to be 42 22 inches. 23 MS. KAPFERER: And can you describe -- 24 I know you talked about accessibility. Can you 25 describe maybe how someone who has a physical Page 95 1 disability might navigate the site, from -- I mean, 2 this is just a typical -- from a car to an 3 apartment? 4 MR. APPEL: So if you -- I'll come to, 5 for instance, I'll just randomly select Building C. 6 You drive into the building as a resident and you 7 will have an accessible stall right opposite the 8 lobby. So you literally drive in, park, walk across 9 the matched area right into the lobby, up the 10 elevator to your apartment. So that's as simple as 11 simple can be. 12 MS. KAPFERER: Okay. Thank you. 13 MR. APPEL: And every portion of the 14 building will be accessible per FHA guidelines. 15 MS. KAPFERER: And can you describe 16 how -- or what differences might exist between an 17 affordable unit versus like a luxury unit? 18 MR. APPEL: So here's a -- we've 19 colored them a little bit differently, so here's -- 20 here's a COAH unit and one-bedroom unit, so you can 21 see they're relatively similar. The COAH units are 22 located, in general, on the shorter side of the 23 building. As I mentioned, the hallway, the 24 corridor, is offset a little bit, so we generally 25 have slightly larger units on one side of the Page 96 1 building. Most of these units will be -- have dens, 2 that's why they're a little deeper, it

orridor, is offset a little bit, so we generally 25 have slightly larger units on one side of the Page 96 1 building. Most of these units will be -- have dens, 2 that's why they're a little deeper, it allows having 3 a little bit kind of nook or alcove that is a good 4 place to put a desk or element like this, but as you 5 can see, they're kind of integrated and spread 6 around, you know, on each of the floors and it was 7 done, you know, in -- you know, intently that when 8 you walk the building, all the doors look the same, 9 you can't tell who's an affordable unit and who is a 10 market unit. 11 MS. KAPFERER: And even, like, 12 fixtures inside or features inside the apartments, 13 are they close in -- I mean, are you able to 14 describe... 15 MR. APPEL: They're -- we haven't 16 gotten that far. 17 MS. KAPFERER: Okay. 18 MR. APPEL: They're usually similar, 19 but usually the kitchens are a little, you know, a 20 little bit smaller, a little tighter, sometimes will 21 not have an island, where a market unit may have an 22 island, but they still will have a washer/dryer, you 23 know, it's not like that they're missing, you know, 24 an element, just some of the elements may be a 25 little bit smaller -- Page 97 1 MS. KAPFERER: Okay. 2 MR. APPEL: -- but they all have the 3 same type of heating and air-conditioning, washer 4 and dryer and, you know -- you know, full kitchens 5 and similar -- similar bathrooms, et cetera. 6 MS. KAPFERER: Okay. I think that's 7 it for now. Thank you so much. 8 MR. APPEL: Thank you. 9 CHAIRMAN BAGOFF: Mr. Cardoza. 10 MR. CARDOZA: Yes, thank you, Mr. 11 Chairman. I think I'll begin by piggybacking off 12 Ms. Kapferer. For the affordable housing units, I 13 believe in previous applications to the Board, we've 14 conditioned that, you know, appliances not be 15 cosmetically substantially different than -- or 16 second tier compared to marketplace units. If we 17 can, I'd just like to submit that, if we can -- 18 CHAIRMAN BAGOFF: The terminology is 19 "materially similar." 20 MR. APPEL: Materially similar. 21 MR. CARDOZA: Thank you. 22 CHAIRMAN BAGOFF: I believe that's 23 what was in our application previously. 24 MR. CARDOZA: Right. 25 MR. APPEL: That's something that I

26 (Pages 98 to 101) Page 98 1 would ask the, you know -- 2 MR. CARDOZA: Yeah. 3 MR. APPEL: -- the developer to do. 4 MR. CARDOZA: Well, as available based 5 on, you know, supply. Right? Okay, that's one 6 thing. 7 I took a lot of notes so I'm going to 8 be jumping around. 9 MR. APPEL: No worries. 10 MR. CARDOZA: Looking at PB-4.7. 11 MR. APPEL: So that was the site 12 section, right? 13 MR. CARDOZA: That's the markup of 14 each type of unit. 15 MR. APPEL: Oh, okay. Let me go to 16 there, okay. 17 MR. CARDOZA: Okay, so this represents 18 every type of unit that would be available -- 19 MR. APPEL: No. 20 MR. CARDOZA: -- across all buildings? 21 MR. APPEL: No. No. These are -- 22 these are representative typical buildings because 23 there are a lot of -- because we've carved the 24 building out and created lots of nuances design- 25 wise, there are a lot of other unit types, so -- Page 99 1 MR. CARDOZA: Okay. 2 MR. APPEL: But these are 3 representative, these were our starting blocks. So 4 when you have a building that, let's say, has a turn 5 where the building kind of angles like a boomerang, 6 -- 7 MR. CARDOZA: Um-hum. 8 MR. APPEL: -- what we'll have to do 9 is we'll have to kind of modify the unit and make it 10 a little bigger, it might get a little smaller. But 11 this gives a starting point for the units -- 12 MR. CARDOZA: Okay. 13 MR. APPEL: -- and as I said, is that 14 these units will go with a sales and marketing team 15 and we will fine-tune this. The units, you know, 16 could jog a little one way or another, the 17 building's not going to grow, but the way some of 18 the units are configured may alter slightly. 19 MR. CARDOZA: All right. But at this 20 moment, these are the plans, you have one-bedroom, 21 one-bedroom plus den, two-bedroom, three-bedroom? 22 MR. APPEL: Correct. 23 MR. CARDOZA: Okay, and that's pretty 24 much -- no further iterations on them or... 25 MR. APPEL: Oh, we're not proposing a Page 100 1 four-bedroom, we're not proposing any studios at 2 this time. I don't want to say -- like, never is 3 never, but this is the typical unit mix -- 4 MR. CARDOZA: Okay. 5 MR. APPEL: -- and we'll just have 6 permutations of same. 7 MR. CARDOZA: All right. And you 8 mentioned that the internal hallways will not be 9 centered. Is that for all four? 10 MR. APPEL: That's how we set up each 11 of the buildings because it just gave more variety 12

All right. And you 8 mentioned that the internal hallways will not be 9 centered. Is that for all four? 10 MR. APPEL: That's how we set up each 11 of the buildings because it just gave more variety 12 to have some units with dens and some without dens 13 and... 14 MR. CARDOZA: Understood. 15 Regarding the shared amenities, could 16 you give us, I don't know, kind of a brief overview 17 of at least proposed what's -- what do all the 18 buildings have in common and what can only be found 19 in the clubhouse, what is unique to each building 20 aside from, you know, you've explained Building D 21 has a rooftop terrace. 22 MR. APPEL: Okay, so to go through -- 23 it's a little tough to go through at this, you know 24 -- 25 MR. CARDOZA: Yeah, I understand. Page 101 1 MR. APPEL: -- because it's going to 2 be very small, but this is Building A-1 and A-2, so 3 what you can see is a common parking podium with two 4 boomerang masses that are separated with an outdoor 5 courtyard between them, and at the two corners in 6 here, we created amenity structures to utilize this 7 courtyard. Now, the roadway is up here, so you 8 basically can go from the roadway right onto this 9 courtyard through these vestibules and open to the 10 building, you know, into the building. The main 11 entrance is on the lower side at these two lobbies 12 that are in the two corner knuckles of the building. 13 So we have these two amenities over 14 here and we have an outdoor amenity space. The 15 remaining portions of this building are all market 16 here. They're all units, there's no other 17 amenities. When we go to another building type is 18 that we have an amenity space right next to the main 19 lobby, so you have the lobby over here, you have an 20 amenity, and then you have a little bit of an 21 outdoor space directly outside that. So Building B 22 has this one small amenity, and when you go to 23 Building C, in a similar fashion, we have this 24 outdoor courtyard over here kind of tucked into the 25 building and we have an amenity space adjacent to

27 (Pages 102 to 105) Page 102 1 the lobby. So that's the formula for Building A, B 2 and C. 3 Building D is a little bit unique, 4 because when you come into the center of the 5 building, we have a gym at the ground floor, so 6 separate from the amenities, I'm going to say the 7 standard -- every building has an elevator core, has 8 stairs, has a trash room, has a mailroom and a 9 package room. All those things are -- I consider 10 those almost necessities, not -- not amenities, but 11 over here, this building has a gym. When you come 12 upstairs, you have other amenity spaces, you have an 13 outdoor amenity space across the lobby, over here 14 (indicating), and on each corner, you have a small 15 amenity space. 16 Can you pan up to the top a little bit? 17 Yes. 18 And then above the gym, we have a club 19 room, and then when we go upstairs again, this 20 repeats itself with these small amenities at that 21 same corner, they're all stacked over here, but 22 these will no longer -- you're above where you have 23 the outside space, so these have no way to get to 24 the outside, but we still have these amenity spaces 25 over here. And if you can pan down. And then we Page 103 1 have this lounge. We're going to call this the sky 2 lounge and I'll explain to you why, because we're 3 going to go to the rooftop. The rooftop -- all of 4 these hatched areas that are dark, all of these 5 hatched areas are private for one of the residents. 6 These condenser farms in here will be screened, 7 where they'll have the mechanical equipment, but 8 rather than spread that all around the building, 9 what we've done is we've created these private roof 10 terraces with a small little bulkhead for stairs and 11 a little place to have, like, a little kind of wet 12 bar or kitchenette over here, and it's just a nice 13 private space that these residents can -- can use. 14 In addition, if you can pan to the left a little 15 bit, we have -- this is a larger public space inside 16 the -- at the roof level. It has a larger view 17 toward -- into the development, so this is looking 18 toward the clubhouse, and this smaller element, 19 which is a view toward the New York skyline. 20 So I'll go to the clubhouse. The 21 clubhouse has a mix of lots of different amenities. 22 Did you want me to walk through the clubhouse also 23 or... 24 MR. CARDOZA: Yes. 25 MR. APPEL: So coming in, you have