April 30, 2025, Planning Board Special Meeting Transcript - WEHI

13 of 48 sheets Page 49 to 52 of 116 05/12/2025 02:23:28 PM 49 you are in the Pine Barrens of New Jersey where the edge1 affect is smaller then you would have more core forest.2 But what we're using here is the number that's applied3 to the institute.4 THE PUBLIC: Makes sense. If it is an5 estimate, in theory you would use lose a little bit more6 than what we estimated, am I wrong there? If it's an7 estimate you would lose more.8 So if the estimate of my 300 number is inaccurate9 A. and let's say it's 500, then there is no core forest.10 If it's 150 then there's more core forest. I'm using11 the best number --12 THE PUBLIC: I understand.13 THE WITNESS: Your using science, it's an14 estimate but it's an estimate in theory. My point is15 you could lose a little bit more than that and it's gone16 and you can't get it back and that's it. Gone.17 THE WITNESS: Well, the amount that's left18 already can't support anything.19 THE PUBLIC: Exactly.20 And another question, the deer in there, I21 mean the deer fence, are we keeping them out or are we22 keeping them in and how many acres does it, does it take23 to support the deer?24 THE WITNESS: From what I understand the25 50 proposal to put up the deer fence is to help with the1 regeneration of plants on the ground where the deer feed2 and lots of people put up deer fencing.3 MS. MCGOVERN: You have to wait until the4 answers finished. The court reporter has to take down5 what you're saying.6 THE PUBLIC: Sure.7 THE WITNESS: Lots of people put up deer8 fences because they want to see results on the forest9 flora by keeping the deer out from browsing everything10 in sight every winter and deer fences work. They do a11 certain thing, but I'm not talking about what deer12 fences do or don't do. I'm talking about what land13 development and the taking away of forest and the14 creation the edge does, which has nothing to do with the15 deer.16 THE PUBLIC: Okay. Thank you.17 CHAIRMAN BAGOFF: Please step up to the mic.18 State your name, sir.19 THE PUBLIC: Orin Knights.20 Thank you, Dr. DeVito for being here today.21 I have two questions to ask.22 First question is regarding the forest core.23 I am not sure exactly the approximate size of that area24 but my understanding is that approximately about 5,00025 51 trees are going to be cut down. So if 5,000 trees are1 cut down is that still considered core forest in that2 space?

ate size of that area24 but my understanding is that approximately about 5,00025 51 trees are going to be cut down. So if 5,000 trees are1 cut down is that still considered core forest in that2 space? Would that still be considered core forest.3 THE WITNESS: It doesn't matter how many4 trees are cut down. When the canopy -- it doesn't5 matter if they were 200 gigantic eight-foot, you know,6 diameter trees that are 400 years old or if they were7 8,000 little trees that are this big. When you take8 away the forest canopy you lose the forest conditions.9 So the development is going to wipe the slate clean.10 They might replant some trees, they might leave a patch11 of trees here or there, but it doesn't matter because12 the development envelope, the limit of disturbance is13 taking away the forest forever and then all you have to14 do is, after that, is look at what forest remains and15 talk about the conditions in that forest. I am,16 everything I have said tonight has nothing to do with17 how many trees they're going to remove, all it has to do18 with is the shape of the patch of forest that is not19 harmed and what happens to that, right. Most of that20 turns from core forest into the edge forest and the edge21 forest doesn't support the lesser, the more uncommon22 species that one would hope that the City of West Orange23 is trying to, you know, keep on the landscape.24 THE PUBLIC: And my second question is, in25 52 regards to the concern for flooding, if that area is1 disturbed, development, how much affect would it have on2 the forest edge? You mentioned about the retention of3 water, would it be -- would it impact, as far as,4 especially downhill because you don't have any5 disturbing the top from the west down, would the forest6 edge be able to contain that type of --7 THE WITNESS: So the only thing, I am not an8 engineer and I don't do stormwater calculations and9 there is going to be other people that testify to that,10 I believe. But the only thing that I can say is that11 the edge forest being more exposed to sunlight and more12 exposed to wind, the soils going to dry out more quickly13 in any given time period. And when it's dry it's going14 to be less accepting of a rainstorm. If a rainstorm,15 you've seen it all in your yard, if a rain comes gently,16 starts slowly, the ground gets wet and the soil17 particles and then absorbs water and water can

accepting of a rainstorm. If a rainstorm,15 you've seen it all in your yard, if a rain comes gently,16 starts slowly, the ground gets wet and the soil17 particles and then absorbs water and water can seep in.18 If the rain comes fast, a big summer thunderstorm, this19 thunderstorm is sometimes over and the ground has barely20 had a chance to accept any of that water, it all runs21 off as surface flooding. It depends on if you have22 sheet flow across the surface or if you have water23 percolating down into the soil and if the soil starts24 out dry, it's not going to absorb a lot of water. On25